It is currently Thu Oct 19, 2017 2:26 am

All times are UTC + 10 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 76 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:36 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:47 pm
Posts: 789
Location: StAlbans Vic
so I picked up the swift today and brought it back home. considering the rough job I did panel beating I'm happy with the outcome.

I have no idea what to do about the driving lights, so I guess I'm off to scrutiny without them.

2 hours to work on it tomorrow and then its one the trailer. Wish me luck.


Attachments:
IMG_20140225_232329.jpg
IMG_20140225_232329.jpg [ 255.78 KiB | Viewed 90 times ]

_________________
"It's not that i lost it, I just run out of room to save it."
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:21 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2006 5:19 pm
Posts: 1971
Location: Launceston, Tasmania
Good luck mate! I love your dedication to these Mk1's! =D>

_________________
Back in the game! Now building something mental... Will I ever finish? I hope so! When? No idea.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 11:27 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:47 pm
Posts: 789
Location: StAlbans Vic
So I gave the bumper a lick of paint and knocked up a light bar and we made it through scrutiny and to the event.

By the end of the first transport the motor was running hot, but we pushed on gently through the first few stages. The temperature was consistent and stable so we continued gently after service.

In the last stage the temperature suddenly jumped just that bit higher and we began to loose power so I ended up parking it just 10km from the finish on the last stage before in fear of throwing a rod out the block and starting an oil fire in the bush.

Back at the service park it really hurt when we say what would have been had we finished the stage. Our stage times were top 10 outright and class winning, but as one of my service crew reminded me "If my aunt had a cock and balls, she'd be my uncle."

The damage has been done unfortunately and we have almost no compression. The autopsy will tell the full story but I am preparing for a full engine rebuild at this stage.

Next event is in 4 weeks. Lets hope its a better!


Attachments:
IMG_20140228_232157.jpg
IMG_20140228_232157.jpg [ 168.07 KiB | Viewed 84 times ]
IMG_20140228_220346.jpg
IMG_20140228_220346.jpg [ 141.05 KiB | Viewed 87 times ]
IMG_20140226_180516.jpg
IMG_20140226_180516.jpg [ 298.41 KiB | Viewed 100 times ]
_20140302_112620.JPG
_20140302_112620.JPG [ 85.55 KiB | Viewed 83 times ]

_________________
"It's not that i lost it, I just run out of room to save it."
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 7:59 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:47 pm
Posts: 789
Location: StAlbans Vic
So the motor is coming out and the spare is going in.

IWhile I'm at it I have a list oof Things to do.

Fix driving Light wiring
cast urethane gearbox mounts
rebush gbox links
Straighten bash plate
clean and paint underbody
Aluminium Radiator
Footrests
Retrimed steering wheel.
Slotted Rotors


Hopefully this lot too but hinging on cheap
CAS and COPS

megasquirt
MK2 manifold
Sr20 tb
Coil on plugs
Custom loom
Wideband


Attachments:
IMG_20140311_235606.jpg
IMG_20140311_235606.jpg [ 369.2 KiB | Viewed 91 times ]

_________________
"It's not that i lost it, I just run out of room to save it."
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:03 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:47 pm
Posts: 789
Location: StAlbans Vic
Does anybody know if the diff ratios are tge same accross all tge mk1. I have a g10, g13b and a g13a box. Is there much difference?

_________________
"It's not that i lost it, I just run out of room to save it."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:55 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2003 12:00 am
Posts: 336
Location: Central Coast
This may not help much, but Mk1 diff ratios seem to be all over the place.. I've owned an 85 Swift, an 88 Barina, an 87 GTi, and a friend had a 87 Barina - all 1.3. The 85 and 88 had identical gearing (3000rpm at 120 in 5th), the Gti was noticeably shorter (just over 4000 at 120), and my friend's 87 seemed to be in between (can't remember exact revs, but the car was definitely perkier).

I'm also under the impression the 1.0 was a bit shorter to compensate for less power?

If you find anything out it'd be great to share it..


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 5:02 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:51 pm
Posts: 1763
Location: Chch - Quake Capital
I can't be 100% certain due to country variances but there should only be 3 combinations.

Mk1 1.3 Sohc's had a standard gearset and 3.52 diff, the Gti had the gti closer gearset and 4.1 diff and other combination is standard gearset and 4.1 diff which all mk1 3 cyls should have, I have also found a few Japanese 1.3 Sohcs also with a 4.1 diff instead of the 3.52.

Easiest thing is to count the teeth thru the yoke inspection plate, 74 for a 3.52 crownwheel and 78 for a 4.1 crownwheel, gti case has an extra mount to the gearbox cross member if I recall correctly.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 7:09 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:47 pm
Posts: 789
Location: StAlbans Vic
Well based on the uncertainty I'll throw in the box that came off the g13a as it requires the least work. If it proves no good it may be reason enough to rebuild another gti box with an LSD.

Is the inspection hole you speak of the small steelplate with three screws?

_________________
"It's not that i lost it, I just run out of room to save it."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:30 pm
Posts: 101
Location: NSW
thats quite a list you got there. Gee the 4 bangers looks so big compared to my little g10. I take it your gear linkage buses are RS. Are you using a short shift currently or going to? Would it help/does it to reduce the extra play as well or not really?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:51 pm
Posts: 1763
Location: Chch - Quake Capital
SOBIL wrote:
Is the inspection hole you speak of the small steelplate with three screws?

Yes.

I can't say with 100% certainty but maybe 99% certain the g13a box will be the absolute worst gearbox to use.

The 3.52 is just rediculous on a rally car, best thing is to use the g13a box as an organ donor for a gti box, things like the low speed syncro hub and 2nd gear, those bits take a hammering in a gti pulling lots of revs and good ones are impossible to find these days.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:40 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:44 am
Posts: 186
Hi,

G13A is 3.78:1
G13B is 4.1:1
G10 eco(commercial) 3.528:1

I need to check my service manual for standard G10.
I just built my gearbox with G13A for my Mini so I know!
My Japanese spec service manual has all of the detail which you don't get in English version.
I will post info later for you.

Cheers
Atchi


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 11:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:47 pm
Posts: 789
Location: StAlbans Vic
Thanks for the confirmation on the box ratios. Sounds like I'm up for more work.

I have enough internals for a gti box "fortunately" as I was in the middle of a reco when someone stole two gearbox cases out of my driveway.

Based on what you guys are saying, I have found the donor box to put the gear set and diff in. I really wish i had the cash for an lsd considering the effort. But alas.... not now.

I checked The g13a box does have less mounts on the back but it comes off another bracket and the cases are the same.

I'm starting to stress about getting the mk2 engine and manifold to fit. The missing mount on the head and the rear clearance could be a problem.

I really don't like cut shifters. This one had one for a while and the time it lost me in difficult/missed shifts outweighs the micropoofteen seconds it saved. That aside I found that the gear shift stabilising rod had no bush on it as some twat forgot the washer. And the rubber bush had worked over the nut... :( The Autocross car has solid engine mounts and hence no shift problems at all. I'm not prepared to go solid on this one yet. Ill try reduce all the play first.


Attachments:
IMG_20140312_233909.jpg
IMG_20140312_233909.jpg [ 343.84 KiB | Viewed 98 times ]
IMG_20140312_233749.jpg
IMG_20140312_233749.jpg [ 342.47 KiB | Viewed 91 times ]

_________________
"It's not that i lost it, I just run out of room to save it."
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:10 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:51 pm
Posts: 1763
Location: Chch - Quake Capital
Atchi are you sure you haven't transposed the g13a and G10 models around? Only the yank model Chevy sprint ER had the 3.78, all other mk1 g10 models had 4.1s, 3 cyl non turbo models had narrow crownwheels so avoid them like the plague.
The only exception is the North American Mk1 Turbo which had the gti diff and crownwheel but missed out on the gti closer ratio gearset.

Just out of curiosity where were your cars built Sobil? we had local assembly here in NZ for mk1s, mostly Holden Barinas, all NZ built g13a's had 3.52 diffs, I have found a couple of imported Japanese badged 'Cultus' models with wide 4.1 cwp but standard gearsets before but generally all the imported and local g13a's had 3.52s.

A mate of mine ran his competition mk1 with a mk3 cultus spec g13b for a couple of years with out the cam end bracket without issue, that bracket doesn't actually do much.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:40 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:44 am
Posts: 186
Hi,

So..... here goes.

This 1st photo will tell you what we are looking at. I know it's Japanese but I'm Jap so I can read it OK!
Attachment:
spec1.JPG
spec1.JPG [ 793.76 KiB | Viewed 88 times ]


This photo will tell you what final ratio you can have in what engine cars...

Attachment:
spec2.JPG
spec2.JPG [ 768.2 KiB | Viewed 89 times ]


As you can see 4.388:1 is what you want in Rally cars!
These are found in G10 3dr and 5dr, 4.1:1 was found in mk1 Turbos. 3.789:1 was found in G13A mk1s.

Cheers
Atchi


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:16 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:47 pm
Posts: 789
Location: StAlbans Vic
If I had two wishes right now they would to have that book .......... and to read Japanese.

What is it saying about the other final drive ratios under the aa43s here:
Attachment:
mk1 ratios.JPG
mk1 ratios.JPG [ 23.61 KiB | Viewed 2313 times ]


I assume all the GTi are all Australian Delivered Imports (No local asssembly). I don't know about the barina and swift, but i didn't think they were assembled here either.

_________________
"It's not that i lost it, I just run out of room to save it."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:52 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:51 pm
Posts: 1763
Location: Chch - Quake Capital
If I read that correctly then the AA43 model which I presume is the g13a model has a 3.52 which is correct, like said earlier I have come across Japanese g13a models with both 3.52 and 4.1's, however most were 3.52.

I've only owned one mk1 g10 model, a Japanese assembled model and it had a 4.1, I've have searched worldwide for years and have not received any confirmed tooth count about a factory 4.4 cwp for a mk1, I'm beginning to wonder if it's an urban myth :lol:

Sobil is there nothing on your build plates about where it's manufactured or assembled?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:18 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:30 pm
Posts: 101
Location: NSW
Ive been having a look at this and trying to make sense of it also.
According to my bulid plates etc I have a jap built AA41 g10 non turbo (coomercial). By any chance could that hold the mystical 4.4 your looking for Dattman?
I am hopeless with gearboxes so I wouldn't know what to look for and I only just put it back in the car on the weekend. There is a serial number on the top of the bell housing where it bolts to the engine, but if it has any significance you would have to tell me.

Seems like we all need to learn Japanese. I just went to my driveway and I have 5 jap cars there lol.

Miniswift would it be hard to make up a table with everything translated to english so we can all enjoy the benefits of the info?

I don't know your time availability, abilities or opinion on it so don't shoot me for asking lol
Just thought If you don't ask you will never know.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 5:31 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:51 pm
Posts: 1763
Location: Chch - Quake Capital
I personally don't want a mk1 4.389 as i don't own a mk1 anymore, there are several guys making cheap 4.4 or lower final drives for reasonable money if anyone wanted one, however I just want to know if it actually exists.

Atchi I was reading your book wrong, I am seriously thinking that book is either wrong or that it only covers Japanese domestic models NOT export models that went to Australia, NZ or anywhere else, to be honest I have only pulled half a dozen of boxes from privately imported JDM models so it hardly a large sample.

Here's what I found

My JDM G10 3 dr had a 4.1 narrow.
Three 3 dr G13a's had 3.52's
One 5dr G13a's had a 3.52
One 5dr G13a had 4.1 Wide

The other dozen or so Mk1 G13a boxes all had 3.52's, these were both NZ assembled Holden Barinas and Japanese assembled swifts which were sold locally.

I've pulled quite a few boxes to send the 3.52's to the States over the last 10 or 11 years, it takes a very strong 3cyl and a patient driver to haul around a 3.52 final drive :shock:

The tooth count is
74 for 3.52
72 for 3.79
78 for 4.1
79 for 4.389

Here is a good thread for figuring out what final drive you have, NOTE it doesn't work for gti's since they have a lower 5th gear, if you did the same procedure it would look like you have a 4.389 diff.
http://geometroforum.com/single/?p=439157&t=4187023


Last edited by Dattman on Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:39 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:30 pm
Posts: 101
Location: NSW
That link is awesome dattman. I will test mine out on the weekend.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: SOBIL's Rally Car
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:17 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:44 am
Posts: 186
Hi,

Oh.... it looks odd isn't it.
UK Mini 16v owners want to have 3.528:1 as we use 10" wheels with G13B engine. This makes 1st gear spot on.
I have several 4.1:1 crown wheel and counter shaft sets. In fact I have gave 3 sets to scrap man last week!

I'm looking for 3.789:1 ratio set as well.
Japanese service manual has information which English version doesn't have so it can be helpful. But in this instance, it is confusing Dattman! I think you are right about different DM has different spec. I'm the one with book gives this info so I thought I share with you. I also have mk1 ph1/ph2 parts catalogue so let me know if any of you wants any parts number!

Cheers
Atchi


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 76 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

All times are UTC + 10 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group